Second debate: as it happens

All times are Comcast standard time, right off our cable box. I'm watching on Fox News. 8:04 Kerry: The flip-flop question. Kerry picks three particular items as straw men and says he hasn't flip flopped. He didn't pick Iraq as one of them. Bush's reply covers a lot of familiar ground, but seems a bit more articulate than usual. 8:08 to Bush: Iraq and WMD vs. North Korea. Tied back to 9/11, which usually plays in his favor. "We all thought there were WMD, including my opponent." Kerry's response attacks Bush by saying he's attacking Kerry. North Korea was not threatening to give their nuclear weapons to terrorists, where Saddam was. Rebuttal: Bush plays the global test card. Kerry misquotes the report on Iraq and WMD. 8:14 to Kerry: How would you establish leadership in Iraq? Kerry says "Absolutely not" like Bush wants to. Pulls in a few hot quotes from Republicans. Claims the U.S. ignored external offers for training. Bush talks about the good words from the Iraqi Finance minister. I love that he turned on the U.S. news and got pessemistic. Rebuttal: Kerry mentions Tora Bora. Bush talks about the war being everywhere, not just UBL. 8:18 to Bush: How do you plan to repair diplomacy with other countries. Answer about doing the right thing even when it's unpopular. Kerry repeats the more-of-the-same argument. That only works if people aren't happy with what they have now. Rebuttal: Bush: "Do you have what it takes". Kerry: "Winning the peace is about more than war." "Our kids killed with ammo from that dump" 8:24 to Kerry: Iran has missiles to hit Israel. Kerry says "you can't rely on just U.N. Sanctions" - finally! Bush and his scowl line - gets a laugh. Gets a hit in on Kerry about multilateral vs. unilateral talks. 8:28 to Bush: How will you maintain the army without a draft. He starts by insisting no draft. Transforming the military is kind of a weak answer, but does explain how we're repositioning people. Kerry's answer: Lists support from people on Bush's staff. Says he's going to increase the size of the military, and make people feel good so they'll enlist. Bush got a bit rude on his rebuttal. 8:33 to Kerry: Why haven't we had another 9/11? (What a question!) Kerry say intelligence is the most important weapon in preventing attacks. Mentions the areas where we aren't yet secure. Bush's answer: Kerry voted to shrink intelligence. Stay on the offense. Says Kerry wants to weaken it, camera shows Kerry smirking. Rebuttal (Charlie repeats the mistake of if/when that Kerry made). Kerry says Bush chose a tax cut over security. Bush says he's worried, but the way to overcome a spirit of hatred is through freedom. 8:38 to Bush: "Why did you block drugs from Canada?" Bush says "I haven't yet, I'm just trying to make them safe." Drugs that look like they're from Canada could be from a third world. Alternatives: speed up generics in the market; senior drug discount program. 2006 medicare drug coverage. Kerry: President said it was a good idea four years ago, vetoed the bill, made it illegal to bulk purchase drugs. Rebuttal: Bush says Clinton also rejected Canadian drugs. Kerry corrects Bush that he did fix Medicare (ouch, if true), and Bush raised deficit. 8:43 to Kerry: Edwards made millions suing healthcare. Kerry says Edwards wrote the patient's bill of rights, malpractice suits cost <1% of healthcare, has plans to reduce healthcare. Bush replies Kerry will tax 2 trillion, missed a vote to help with Senate. Says 1% increase is not accurate. Says Kerry's healthcare plan is socialized medicine, tax-and-spend. Rebut: Kerry says Bush is trying to scare us. Bush says Kerry should have voted for the cap on malpractice on the senate floor. 8:48 to Bush: "Republican majority, how do you expect to pay for it without taxes". Bush recalls the recession and market bubble pop. I haven't vetoed bills because we've worked together to spend money on the right things. I'm not going to raises taxes to hurt our recovery. Kerry refers to the tax cuts and says it's not possible. 8:54 to Kerry: "will you promise to the camera that you will not raise taxes on those with income under $200000". Kerry says "Yes", but doesn't actually make the promise. Says he's going to restore pay-as-you-go. Promises a rollback of those over $200000. Bush: he's not credible. Voted to break spending caps over 200 times. Way to grow is to keep taxes low. Rebut: Gibson again tries to ask how they'll reduce the deficit. Kerry: Didn't really answer the question, in my opinion. Bush tackles Kerry's reply and also misses the answer. 8:59 to Bush: "How do you call yourself an environmentalist". He lists a variety of programs, reducing this by 90%, fund that by 30 million, reduce something else by 70%, healthy forest bill. Kerry answers again with "labels don't mean anything", says the Clean Air Act would be better than what we have now. "Doesn't believe in science, I do." Rebuttal: Bush says the Kyoto Treaty doesn't help. Common sense approach. Kerry: Kyoto treaty was flawed, but Bush didn't try to fix it. Says walking away was part of the reason other countries don't like us. 9:04 to Kerry: How can the US be competitive and maintain our standard of living? True cost to businesses is healthcare and the President has no plan. Bush: Outlines his healthcare plan, points to Kerry's top 2% as bad for small business. Rebut: Small business claim is false, says Bush owns a lumber company. Bush gets a good laugh off that one, offers Gibson to buy some wood. 9:10 to Bush: Patriot Act why are my rights being watered down. Bush: not eroding your rights, must have every tool necessary. Cannot do their duty without Patriot Act. Kerry: Many key people want Patriot Act changed. Terrorists must never change our constitution. 9:13 to Kerry: Embryonic stem cell research. Kerry: I respect the feeling behind that question. (Huh?) I think we can do ethically guided stem cell research. Bush: Embryonic research requires the destruction of life. I'm the first president to approve stem cell research. Have to be careful to balance ethics and science. Rebut: Kerry says Bush is waffling, and current supply is not adequate. Bush: embryo had already been destroyed, I decided not to allow destroying more. 9:18 to Bush: Vacancy in the Supreme Court. Bush: "I'm not telling". Good one. Says it would be someone who supports constitution, won't let his opinion control his decisions. Kerry: the Justice Potter Stewart standard. 9:22 to Kerry: Tax dollars to support abortion. He replies "I can't take an article of faith for me and legislate it for someone who doesn't agree." Says he can take that position and not be pro-abortion. Still ends up saying he would spend money on abortions. Bush: plain and simple answer. Culture of life is important for a country. Rebut: It's not that simple. Bush: it is. 9:27 to Bush: Three mistakes and what you did to correct it. He dodges the question. Kerry jumps in with some examples for him. Kerry's rewound to the first question. No great suprises in the closing statements. A winner? Bush had more quoteable moments than Kerry, I think. Bush came off more forceful, which I think will play well except where he cut off Gibson. No great gaffes on either side. There's plenty of material here for each side to claim victory. Don't miss a look at the new ABC memo, which shows an ABC exec encouraging the news organization to play things in Kerry's favor. The fact that the last question of the evening was almost an invitation to poke holes in Bush doesn't fare well. (Charlie Gibson works for ABC.) It's striking how Kerry tries so hard to be different from Bush in every way, shape and form. It's almost as if Kerry can't find anything nice to say about the President, no sense of teamwork or giving credit where credit is due.